Amber Karnes 0:01
Oh, yeah, good. Sorry, I
Unknown Speaker 0:03
So be good to check in on that. Sorry, do that. Yeah, I think Darlene, did you have your hand up?
Amber Karnes 0:13
I was just gonna ask about the recording. Thank you. Just thought of it. All right. Um, yeah, I'd love to check in about that. I know, Jivana took y'all through some of those planning questions. And just wondering like, how did that feel? Did any of you implement any of those steps? Or like, what's your plan going forward? And maybe each of each of you could check in? And let us know
Unknown Speaker 0:36
about some of that. So, yeah, anybody want to go first? Go ahead, Darlene. Okay, so I actually kind of made a list of what my mini course is going to be designed, like. So it's gonna do yoga for migraines for beginner series. So like a series of classes, utilising just watch hair, and beginning standing poses at bed. Those are my only props, or things that are found around the house, because I didn't want people to like feel like they had to go out and buy stuff, the length of time between five to 20 minute classes, started off small and gradually work their way up. And plus tutorials. And then resources, I was wondering about resources, sort of like a, like a thing where people can, like, if they want to buy props, you can just give them like stuff that they could do. I mean, and then also, since I have a background in design, I was gonna do like the effects of like colour, calming versus stimulating colours, so that they can help because that actually is very appropriate to people with migraines, colour sensitivities. And then the types of classes I was going to do is focus on balance, strength and coordination.
Jivana Heyman 2:05
Well, there's a name again, the title, yoga for migraines. Oh, that's great. Yeah,
Amber Karnes 2:12
I love that you kept the classes short, too. Like that's, I think, a really approachable way to do that. Yeah, that's really exciting to hear, like, kind of all come together. Um, you had questions about the resources, though? Like, what? Can you ask that question again?
Unknown Speaker 2:28
Um, well, I wanted to provide like resources to the students sort of like, hey, if you want to buy some props, or here's some things like I have, like allergies and stuff like that. So I had to do like a lot of hunting for things that were appropriate to me. And I just wanted to like put together like a resource guide for potential for the students. But is that something that you could include, I guess, can include anything, but is that sort of useful?
Amber Karnes 2:55
I think so. I mean, I always love to give, if I'm going to do a workshop or a series or something that they can take home, you know, like a little takeaway, and if it's online, it can be a PDF or link or something. But I think students really appreciate that I know, when I go to a workshop or something, I like to have that, you know, kind of a study guide, or notes or the resources that we've talked about. So I think that's really smart to share the things that you that have been successful for you. And maybe that's something that, you know, if people are coming to the class series, and they have migraines, then maybe they have things that have worked for them, and you could like crowdsource a resource list together. And that could be something that the class works on together, like in a Google doc or something like that. Oh, cool. Okay. Yeah. Sounds
Jivana Heyman 3:39
great. It's also nice to create some kind of ongoing community discussion, like if it's, even if it's a very small group, it's nice to offer them. I don't know, like a private Facebook group or some way to continue to communicate with each other to share resources, like you said, but also for mutual support beyond the class.
Amber Karnes 4:01
Okay. Yeah, sounds good. Thank you. So do you have a plan of when you might be offering this or what format it might take? Are you playing an offer in person or online
Unknown Speaker 4:11
like online or online only, um, I'm shooting for beginning of the year since most people tend to like to reboot themselves at the beginning of the year. Yep. Um, and actually just got through with the webinar with offering tree. And it's sort of like another version of kajabi, but less expensive, and it seems pretty,
Amber Karnes 4:35
pretty good. They're sponsored stuff for us for Accessible Yoga. And I know a lot of teachers have really enjoyed using them. Sarah, have you participated with them?
Unknown Speaker 4:49
Yeah, I'm carrying out because I just didn't want to invest the time in like creating a website if I didn't know exactly what I wanted to do. And I've liked it so far. I've been using it for a couple months and I've been scheduling if possible. Thurman's pretty easy shape. Very cool.
Amber Karnes 5:05
All right, Darlene. So when you post this offering, I hope you'll share it with us so that we can give you a little signal boost. That's very exciting to see how you're bringing in into the community. Okay, thank you. Yeah, thank you for sharing that. Um, does anybody else want to share maybe what you're planning? If you don't have it all thought out, like Darlene did. That's okay. Like, we're here to support y'all. Anybody else want to go? Yeah, go. Okay. Um, so,
Unknown Speaker 5:42
this thing, and I definitely don't have the kind of list that darlie had. But the thing that keeps coming up for me, and I really appreciated the prompt questions last time. And everybody's frozen. So I don't know if I'm still audible. Audible, can you hear us? Okay. Yes, no. Um, so the thing that came up for me is this thing that has been repeated about kind of valuing your time valuing your offerings, and therefore not, you know, giving things away for free, maybe giving, like an intro, that is free, but then, for some reason that's ringing really uncomfortable with me, for the particular class that I'm wanting to do. At least for right now. Because for me, in part, so the, the title that I'm kind of working with, is yoga for mixed race folks fo LX intentionally to try to kind of communicate, you know exactly who it's for, but also the inclusivity of kind of that selling of folks. And because a big part of it is kind of longing to create the community that I want, like for right, this second, it feels really uncomfortable for me to put up any barrier to that. And I don't know if that's also partially because I'm also like, very heavily kind of geared towards caretaking mode. And so I don't know how much of it is like, No, actually, I just want to create a community and then worry about finances or I don't know. So just thought I would invite thoughts about that
Jivana Heyman 7:54
thought, which is to make it by donation. It's basically free. And then if people want to donate, they can, you know, okay. Yeah, that's a nice way to go.
Amber Karnes 8:06
Yeah, I think so too. And I mean, you never have to charge for your offerings. You know what I mean? I think when we talk about that, it's more around, you know, I've seen dynamics before, where studios want teachers to work for free all the time in the name of service and that sort of thing. And so, I think it's important to have boundaries as a teacher. And we're going to talk about that a little bit today, actually. And so that means around your time, and your effort, and all of that as well. But there's also the option to do volunteer work and service and all that. Like, I think that that's, if that's part of the mission of it great. And I mean, if there's a real material cost to it, you know, you could think about ways that you could get that sponsor, but still make it free to participants. So for example, I always encourage people to check in with your local library system or your recreation, you know, parks and rec, because oftentimes, they'll have like a programming budget, and they'll pay you to teach but the people can attend for free. And, you know, you could also seek out like members in your community, who might be willing to offer like a little sponsorship to sponsor scholarships for people, you know, there are some ways that you could be creative about that sort of thing if you needed to be paid for the work, but still wanted it to be free. So those are just some other ideas. But I think by by donation, the Oh, you know, tip jar sort of system like works really well. And I find that, you know, if folks are finding value in what you do, they're probably going to want to support you. So anybody else have thoughts on that they want to add?
Unknown Speaker 9:45
Go ahead, Sarah, or teacher class a week where it's by donation, and I've decided like for that class, anything that gets donated is going to a specific nonprofit. And like I did one last month. For like residential school survivors in Canada, and now I've changed one for this month going forward to support women in Afghanistan, like I just picking different things. And then people can decide if they want to contribute to that or not. But then I'm also offering other offerings that people are going to pay for. So I can still explain like finding, trying to find a balance. Thank you.
Amber Karnes 10:24
So helpful, Amanda.
Unknown Speaker 10:26
Yeah, it was and also just I love that, Sarah.
Amber Karnes 10:36
Yeah, definitely. So are you Is there anywhere that you you feel like you're kind of stuck with it, Amanda, or any questions or still kind of thinking things through.
Unknown Speaker 10:50
It's a little hard to talk through this and be vague, and I'm trying to be vague. I'm just in terms of one thing, because this is being recorded. But I'm building a community with other mixed race people at the moment, that's amazing so far, but also we're we're not allowed to, like endorse or promote anything outside of that community. And so I'm, I'm, but I'm befriending people. And so I'm just figuring out how to navigate that line. And I think that's the other reason why I'm like, because I would love people to feel free to come to the class. But if I'm charging anything for it, that could get really weird. So I actually, I do like that donation thing. And I've just got to figure out a way to keep it very separate. Um, well, also, like this intentional community that I'm building, like, I feel like I'm not excluding people who are actually my friends. So it's just a weird line. And I don't know if anybody has experience with kind of those kind of boundaries. You mean, working with friends. And when communities kind of overlapped in a way where you don't want one community to kind of feel like you're trying to pull people into another because I'm not trying to do that.
Amber Karnes 12:37
I mean, to me, you know, I would think this would be less about like, Oh, I'm creating this other thing, that's a competing interest and more about, like, I'm creating this programme, and here's an invitation to you, because you're part of the community, I've created this programme for, you know, we, maybe your your group has served, I don't know if this is like an online group or in person, but like, you know, the Accessible Yoga community on Facebook, for instance, has certain rules about how you can share things that you want to promote, like, we have a special thread where people post that. So it's not just like, spam with like, programmes all the time. And so maybe there's something like that, that your group could put in place, or, you know, you could talk with your group about this and just be like, you know, have we thought about, you know, when people create resources, how we want to share that in a way that feels good to everybody. Like, maybe there can be, you know, a discussion like that I'm not really sure how open people are to that. And I think like, there's also a difference between, you know, sort of spamming the community message boards, and inviting people individually, one on one, just saying, like, hey, I want to share this work that I'm doing and if it's relevant to you great. And if not, no worries, you know? Yeah. I don't know quite what the rules are of your group. You don't have to, like, you know, go into that if it's confidential, or whatever. But
Unknown Speaker 13:56
yeah, um, I think, I mean, that Yeah, that was kind of what I was seeing as it's probably just gonna have to be a one on one off, can you kind of a conversation? If I'm friends with somebody? And if not, then, oh, well, yeah,
Amber Karnes 14:12
I think don't dismiss that, you know, what I mean? Like, I think a lot of times, we think, oh, we have to have some big platform or like a bunch of people on our mailing list or whatever, but don't discount the like, personal invite because I think almost when it's like, when it has to do with affinity groups or sort of certain population, like what we're talking about here, you know, it really means something to be like, Hey, you know, I have shared lithic lived experience and I created basically a support that I needed and I want to invite you to share that if you if you want to and I think people feel really seen you know when it's something like that. So I encourage you to like you know, share from a personal place and less of a like, advertising place if that makes sense. It does like land difference. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Awesome. Anybody else Want to share what you're working on or thinking about? Thank you, Amanda, it's great.
Jivana Heyman 15:05
I haven't been on the last couple calls. Is it horribly embarrassing?
Amber Karnes 15:10
It's all good. Good to see you. Again,
Jivana Heyman 15:12
I did have an interesting experience that is somewhat of an Accessible Yoga experiences I taught yoga at Zen, Buddhist silent meditation retreat. And I found that so I was, it was interesting to know that I was actually allowed to talk but thinking about the communication that students were not supposed to talk, and actually felt guilty. You know, I just automatically ended with nama stay at the end, and a couple of students know followed on. I was like, Well, I suppose maybe they're allowed to say no, I'm a stay? I don't know. It's, it's it's kind of unclear to me what, you know, what people are allowed, allowed to say, but what was perhaps most fascinating was the, the realisation that I had afterwards, particularly after having a read a comment on waivers, where, you know, my, my waiver typically says, you know, that I have the right to take photos where motional purposes and one student wrote down, you know, photos, please. And so I thought about this afterwards, and I realised that, yeah, I was teaching yoga is a form I teach at this meditation centre every week, and so I filled it with community, but this particular retreat was, was very specifically a journey by each of the people in that retreat into a, into a, you know, a oneness with themself. And it was, it was, you know, I, I think, actually, if I thought about it more, before I actually taught if I would have been a little bit more terrified, because it was, it was a lot more powerful for them. And they, I got good reviews from my class, it was a lot more powerful for them as, as a moment of teaching, than or more of learning than I actually realised. So it was kind of a it was, it was, I think, some of the training I had in the Accessible Yoga, programme help. And it was kind of like a special population in a way that you're, you're, you're just not your run of the mill class, you have to treat the way you teach and the way you think about the class differently, and I was very powerful.
Amber Karnes 17:30
Thank you for sharing about that. That's very cool. It would feel kind of funny to be like the one person allowed to talk, I have to say, like, I've got a doctor's appointments recently, and I took my mask off, and I'm just like, oh, but everyone else? I don't know, it's kind of funny.
Jivana Heyman 17:46
I've been in that situation. I've taught a lot on silent retreats. And the challenge is also consent. I mean, if you I don't know if you're touching anybody, but you know, normally, that's really that's the thing, you just can't touch anybody and ask for consent, because they're not supposed to respond to like, normally, I would be talking to somebody and ask them a question and give individual support, even like, go and help one student, you can't really do that. Because engaging with them in that way would encourage them to speak. So in a way, it's almost like teaching online, it just becomes very, it's just like, very neutral. You're sitting there, you're just giving instruction, maybe demonstrating and not expecting interaction with them. But I think I mean, I love silent retreats. Personally, I did, I taught them for probably 15 years and miss it a lot. So I love hearing your story. It was, you know, it was interesting, you know, as I you know, some of the you know, I've taught there and I kind of understood where you were going, I thought well, you know, it would be interesting, you know, partner yoga situation where we could put two people back to back and you feel feel the breath movement and, and the oneness with another individual thought that's like, well, that's probably not the way to go when a Silent Retreat, right. I mean, it was kind of like, I was trying to think of ways to allow people to really focus on their breath or their inner connection with others and, and yet, in a Silent Retreat, as you said, that's, you know, there's you coming into yourself, and so it, it was just curious.
Amber Karnes 19:23
Thanks for sharing about that. Yeah, it's challenging to think about, you know, how things need to change based on the needs of like, who's in the room, and I think that's a really interesting opportunity that you mentioned. Cool. Thank you, Andy. Um, Astrid, or Sarah, do you have anything you want to share? how things are going planning anything you're planning any questions?
Unknown Speaker 19:50
I can share. Well, full disclosure. I was not here last time and I did not watch the recording. So I don't know what your prompts but I'm guessing there some about creating, like a plan for an offering.
Amber Karnes 20:04
Yeah, it's like a planning template for thinking about all the stuff you have to do to make an offer.
Unknown Speaker 20:08
Well, I've thought of one while we've been here. So I've been thinking about writing a, like a five week sort of intro course to yoga for bigger bodies asynchronously. So I've been like, not sorry, that's like a college teaching word, but like, not live. Because I just started teaching once a week, like yoga for bigger bodies live class, and I thought, maybe people might be nervous to join that. So they could have something like they could do on their own first make, see if they feel comfortable and then join. So I was thinking, like, five weeks. And I thought I could focus on like a couple different Asana each week, and do like a 10 minute video of me demonstrating some variations. And then they could practice them and then have like 230 minute recordings of a practice that included those Asana and they could do that. And then maybe I could make myself available for like, an hour week for anyone that's participating. They want to come on zoom and ask questions. That's sort of as far as I got.
Amber Karnes 21:20
I love it. You do so good. Are you going to like deliver this through email? Or are you creating like a little thing to log into? Have you thought about that? Yeah, I
Unknown Speaker 21:30
was thinking like through offering tree, actually, I think they have a thing. If you purchase it through there, then you can log in, and you can actually like, send things out? Or like it'll be available week by week on offering tree. If they've, I don't know what that's called, like, titrate or something?
Amber Karnes 21:45
Yeah. Like an automated email sequence. And then they like, drip out the content. Yeah, drip out. Yeah, something like that. Yeah. So that's what I'm thinking. Cool. I think this is, I think, is super smart. I think it's great to have an onboarding programme to like anything that you do, especially if it's for like, you know, there's some skills that need to be taught before they might want to join the, you know, the regular class. And I think it's a great resource to help like build your mailing list to like, if you have a website, or you can share on social media, and people are definitely going to be interested in that. I would encourage you to argue coming to the community forum next week. Okay, good. Good. I hope you'll share about that if you have somewhere that people can drop their email, even if you kind of start a new Google doc or something you don't have like a Google form to collect it. If it's not right yet. Like I definitely encourage you to, to share there because we want people to share about their work. And that sounds super cool. Thank you for creating that resource.
Jivana Heyman 22:47
Awesome. Thanks, Mandy is to go Yeah, thanks, Andy. We'll see ya.
Amber Karnes 22:55
Are you stuck anywhere Sarah are any questions are
Unknown Speaker 22:59
more like stuck on making myself do it? So I have this problem where I have lots of ideas, and I can't like make myself do them. Like I've, I've written out a webinar, like a PowerPoint for a webinar for just like an intro to using props as like a freebie to some people, and I just can't make myself finish it. So I don't know how I don't know. I'm like the ultimate. Why Why
Amber Karnes 23:22
is what's your brain telling you a little later and good reasons? Or is it just like, I don't want it?
Unknown Speaker 23:30
Yeah, no, I don't know. I'm just like, the ultimate procrastinator with everything. So I need to somehow fix them. What's one
Amber Karnes 23:36
little tiny baby step that you could take to like, maybe tomorrow to make one little, you know, kind of increment of progress? Like, is there? Have you kind of made a start to finish checklist of like, this is all the stuff we need to do?
Unknown Speaker 23:49
Yeah, like, really, all I need to do is like film content, or like, I've already made the PowerPoint, like weeks ago. Okay, so
Amber Karnes 23:56
is this a reasonable, I don't know if request is the right word, but like, put on your calendar, the day that you're going to film and go ahead and like block that time off. I noticed, like when I have to create content, like I really need a lot of space, I need to like not have a bunch of zoom calls that day or whatever. And I think like getting it on the calendar and really having that dedicated time kind of, you know, it'll give you a motivator to be like, well, I blocked off the whole day or whatever. You know, for me, that really helps to create some space and like, get it on there intentionally like otherwise it doesn't happen. I don't know. Jivana How do you make yourself I was gonna
Jivana Heyman 24:32
say, sir, you've been doing stuff because I've been following you on Instagram.
Amber Karnes 24:38
I can do short things. Short, Instagram videos are quick. What's your Instagram name? Sarah, I want to make sure I'm following you to yoga on your terms. Oh, good.
Jivana Heyman 24:49
Yeah, I was impressed that it keeps coming up. You know, so I feel like you're doing some regular posting, obviously. That's amazing. So seems like you're doing it. Actually, since short things are good,
Amber Karnes 25:05
short things are good. You know, what I decided recently is like, all these asynchronous courses and things that I have, it's like when you want to re record something, now I have this like hour long module that I have to do. So when I re record it, I'm actually going to do like smaller videos and do like one video per slide. That way, it's only like two to five minutes or whatever, you know, and you go through that. And then that way, people can kind of make their way through it at a little better pace, rather than like, okay, I've just sit down for two hours to watch this lecture or something. So I don't know if that might help to break it up a little that way. But that's something I'm trying.
Unknown Speaker 25:42
People were trained retain information better that way too. Anyway. Like, if you actually watch something for an hour, you're gonna get like, 10 minutes of it.
Amber Karnes 25:52
Yeah, yes. Thank you. Okay, great. Yeah. Thank you. Astra. Do you have anything you want to share?
Unknown Speaker 26:00
Yes, so I shared like an idea, which I think is something a little like, probably also more for the new year. Last time, about really working with super beginners or people really using, they can't do yoga whatsoever can go to a class and offering that online. However, like with my friend that I'm working on a regular basis. So she said that she's a very good networker. And so she already knows several people who would be potential, also one on one people, and she's, so she's not paying me she's having me. So that's sort of, for me priority right now. Because that's really what I want to do to kind of work with people one on one, and my summer is usually very crazy. I mean, I still have a daughter in high school and a lot of like, not regular stuff. And that's sort of my biggest challenge is, you know, I'm impressing her that you do something on a regular basis, my heart is challenged, and to really commit to doing something like every Wednesday at whatever I can, or so, yeah, that's something I'll have to work with. But that also has something to do with my like energy levels. So that's very, like, up and down. So I'm not sure how to incorporate in offering something regularly.
Amber Karnes 27:33
You know, something that's worked for me when I need a little bit more flexibility is, rather than doing like a weekly series, or something like that, either just doing pop ups, like as it works for you, you know, a sort of like, one off class or webinar presentation, or whatever. And then you can kind of just pick like, Okay, I'm going to do one about every month, or about every six weeks, and maybe that's a little longer offering, or rather than just like a weekly class forever, like make it a shorter series off the sun is back of like, two or three weeks, make it something super short. You know, when I first started teaching, that was one of the things that I want to offer was like yoga for people who think they can't do yoga. And we just did a three week beginner series, and the classes were like, 45 minutes, we kept it very basic. We had like chairs, and that was it like nothing too fancy. And I think that really worked for people like it was enough that they were interested, we got to learn some basic skills, but it wasn't like any of us had to commit to like six weeks in a row, you know. So maybe those are some ideas. I don't know if any of the rest of you have ways you built in flexibility.
Jivana Heyman 28:47
I want to talk about just how private sessions are different than group classes and how you know, out of all, like the full time yoga teachers I know, generally, you know, they can they make more money, doing private lessons, or teacher training that those two areas like, like workshops, and teacher training, or kind of specialty, professional level training, or privates tend to be the way to actually make a living as a yoga teacher. So I think focusing on privates is a really good idea, to be honest, and also tends to be a little less intimidating, what depends on your personality. Some people you know, when they're newer teachers feel more comfortable one on one, sometimes it's too much, it's too intense. But there are also some different techniques you can use when you're doing one on one teaching. It's slightly different than group teaching. And like, it depends on your personality and like it can be really nice. You can have a kind of ongoing conversation with that person, which is very different than you would do in front of a class. Also, some people when you're doing privates, I would just say really watch the this in terms of the student how much attention They want some people want like 100% of your attention, and some people, that's overwhelming. And so you can do more of a parallel practice with them. Which I like to give people that option kind of, I can just sit here and watch you, and like, give you a lot of feedback, or we could practice kind of together. If that could work, sometimes that feels less intimidating. And I think for people, for newer students, it can be really nice to have one on one time, you know, to get them more comfortable practising. Or if people have a disability, or some special thing going on, and they want to know, they want to talk about it, you know, a lot, you can be awesome. Anyway, so I think that's great to do.
Amber Karnes 30:42
Yeah, that, you know, I appreciate you saying the differences between the one on one, I would say, just to add to what I said before, um, you know, maybe what you do, rather than, like, okay, we meet every Tuesday at 10 is like, we're gonna book three sessions at a time. And so like, you'll sit down and schedule that together. And then on the third session, we scheduled three more, or something like you could, you know, have some regularity, but it wouldn't have to be very rigid. If that makes sense. I'm obsessed with this idea of like building in flexibility to things because I just feel like the last two years have been so wild, it's like been very hard to predict, and have any sort of like, ongoing long term, you know, programme. So I appreciate you bringing that up.
Jivana Heyman 31:27
Yeah, the other thing I just mentioned about I don't know, if you really want to talk about privates, but I got excited, because that's also the direction of yoga therapy. And, you know, you can have group yoga therapy, but one on one, yoga therapy is kind of a little more common. And I think it can be a great way to kind of test yourself and see am I interested in really exploring that more and, you know, do I like that kind of interactive experience where it's more in depth with each student, rather than kind of this, you know, group class where students kind of come and go, and I don't want to have a lot of kind of very intense interaction with them. Because in a one on one, it can really be very intimate. And you can really learn a lot about a person and give them more support. In fact, I would just say that even if you're not a yoga therapist, you could still offer individual support and additional resources like actually darling was mentioning earlier. One thing I would always do in one on one Sessions is to create sequence with the person that then they would practice on their own. So I would spend the time not just like, oh, let's just do this class today, but actually, like creating a programme, like, here's a 30 minute session that, you know, what, like, what is it that you're looking for? Like, I would also quiz them, like, what are you looking for? What are you, you know, what do you want out of yoga, and then together, create a class that serves them, either write it down for them, or they write it down. And then they could bring it home and actually have that as homework to like, practice before you see them again next time and really have them engage with yoga as a personal practice and give them homework. some exciting
Unknown Speaker 33:08
things. One big reason for me is that I, I mean, I learned that actually in my already in the teacher training. Because someone talked about how excited they are one of the teachers, they are to be back in person and the energy of the whole room. And that actually almost scares me. Like, it's, I'm really more this I feel so intense the energy of other people that I might be overwhelmed by that. If there's like, 20 people, and they'll come in with their baggage. It's like, Where am I in this? And how can I guide them? So it's almost like it's like this one person. I feel like I can really feel where they're at, and where they might want to go and what helps them relax or not. And so it's, that just seems a lot more manageable for me too. And so, yeah, I'm really not like, I'm not even searching to teach huge classes. It's really a sort of, I feel like I'd probably have a max at six maybe at some point, I can do it if I get more routine and but I I'm not sure I have enough filter to.
Jivana Heyman 34:16
I mean, not everyone needs to teach group classes. It's not required. Like,
Amber Karnes 34:20
I don't want to teach privates you know, like, it takes all kinds to like do anything for sure.
Jivana Heyman 34:25
But like I'm saying like, most of the yoga teachers, I know Hootie hoo hoo, aren't just doing teacher training, they're doing privates. That's how they're surviving. And it's very effective. So I think it's a great it's a great path as a teacher. That makes me very excited. And Francesca, is it Francesca? You're gonna mention Amber. Yeah, I can read her mind now.
Amber Karnes 34:49
Yeah, I was gonna talk about her. I know. Go ahead.
Jivana Heyman 34:53
Francesca cervera. Has that chorus Did you maybe you already studied it? Someone one of you mentioned that I think yeah. Okay,
Amber Karnes 35:02
yeah. Francesca, I'll put her link in the chat. And she has something called the science of the private lesson, which is like a mentorship community that she has around us for teachers. But also, she has a lot of like good free information out there, and a really good podcast called the mentor sessions. And she talks a lot about teaching privates and that sort of thing. So definitely check her out, she's a really good resource. And I know make some really decent living teaching private lessons, so and has for a long time.
Jivana Heyman 35:30
And I also think privates work better online than group classes online, you know, so I think that's something that can be done. Either way, you know, in person or online right now. So it really encouraged. It's exciting.
Amber Karnes 35:43
So I'm glad that you said something about, you know, that the energy of other people can like feel overwhelming, like everyone bringing their baggage in because Jivana, and I wanted to talk about boundaries and self care for us as teachers today. And even if you're not actively teaching, like, I think it's important to talk about this, because everybody needs self care, even if you don't have, you know, students to balance that with so Jivana, do you want to talk about this a little bit? How do you set boundaries with students? Like, what do we even mean by that?
Jivana Heyman 36:13
Yeah, I have a lot of a lot, a lot of thoughts about this. I think it's a really important topic. And the, the simple part is that, you know, we need to take care of ourselves, so that we can teach, right, I mean, that's kind of obvious. But I think when you really start to explore it and examine it, it's way more complicated. And it's, it's both finding a way to take care of yourself through like us using yoga for yourself care. But also having boundaries and limiting the interactions with your students in a way that feel safe and protected for you. Because I think most people that become yoga teachers are really into service or really wanting to give and share. And that's beautiful. And so you can you can get energy from that. I mean, I often feel energised from teaching, but it can also be draining. And there's I find it can be both at the same time even, which doesn't really make a lot of sense. But I think it's that in some ways, it's energising in other ways it's draining. And I'm I'm an introvert, you know, I'm very shy, actually. So for me, is taking a lot of time and experience to be able to teach and not be drained and exhausted afterwards. And so I so I, that's just the beginning, I had some questions about it for you. I don't know if you want to you want to say anything first Amber's about it. This will topic.
Amber Karnes 37:44
I mean, I'll just say that maybe the last couple years have definitely been a big lesson in this for me, because, you know, I was travelling a tonne in 2019, and teaching almost every weekend. And then COVID hit and that really, like changed everything for me. And now I'm, you know, pretty much on the computer whenever I'm working. And I would say that, like, you know, I learned a lot while I was travelling about like, how much extra time I need to like, you know, arrive somewhere and really, like, do the things to prepare, so that my energy is really grounded and in a good place. So that I could like hold space for people. And online, I think those skills can be really even a different a little bit different. And for me a little bit more difficult. I even was like really enjoyed teaching online and sort of, you know, you're like a fish in water. And I'm just like, oh my god, I need to be in a room with people. So I think for me, it's been you know, when I've struggled a little bit this past year, especially I've been dealing with, like some depression and burnout and stuff like that, and I'm almost kind of like, I don't know, I'm, I'm getting ideas again, and stuff after taking, like quite a substantial break. And so I think, you know, I've been teaching for a while and doing like community building stuff for a long time. But I think that I've never really had to be like super intentional about, you know, sort of, like making sure that I have my mental health taken care of to a to a place where I can show up as a teacher and show up and like hold space for people and be supportive. And so, you know, I would just say like, I've kind of learned this lesson the hard way where you know, for, I mean, several months this year, I've been sort of like feeling lost and like not sure what to do and feeling burnt out and that kind of stuff and and I think it's just important to consider this stuff and be really mindful about it as you go. Like I almost find it helpful for me sometimes when I'm struggling to kind of track my energy levels and figure out like, you know, make some notes kind of after you teach like what worked What didn't I think for me when I was travelling a lot and feeling really tired and sometimes like not building in enough space on on either end, like I would, you know, try to notice that and, and do it the next time or, you know, for me like, when I schedule a day of zoom meetings back to back to back and I don't have time to like go to the bathroom or take my dog out, like, hopefully I'll notice that and then start to put in some some sort of structure that can help you a little bit more supportive. So, I don't know, I rambled a little bit there. But I just say like, this has definitely come up for me, you know, and
Jivana Heyman 40:27
but I want to say that I had the opposite experience as you Because for me, I found that stopping. Because I was doing all that travelling also, for many years and stopping it was really great. Like, I didn't realise how exhausted I was, and the toll it was taking on me. And it was also being in the room with all those people like Astrid was saying, I'm very sensitive. And so being in big groups was exhausting. And I didn't realise that. And I kind of love it. Like I love teaching big groups, but it really wears me out quickly. And doing it online just feels much easier. It doesn't drain me in the same way. It's different, though there's certain amount of energy you need to teach online. But yeah, it's not like, it's not, it's not that intense feeling that I would get. And so I've I've had more time, since we stopped since I stopped travelling. Now, it's been about a year and a half, almost a year and a half that I've just been able to take care of myself, and my do my practice more, exercise more, eat better. I'm literally like, all those things are easier for me because I have a regular routine at home. And so for my body type in my life, it's just been really helpful, like being on the road was exhausting. And so I guess I wanted to ask you some questions about that. And what I mean, I'll ask you that we don't have that much time. So I have some things for you to if you don't make some notes, maybe this is just something you can think about later even. Because I think what I wanted to share with you today is just that moving forward, I realise I think you're all newest teachers. And so it might seem like oh, I'll just do whatever. But I think you really need to, like learn right away to be sensitive to your to your own needs. So that teachers can become positive experience for you and not draining. Alright, so the question is really, oh, and also, before we go into those, I just want to bring up boundaries. And maybe I can mention that again at the end of the questions, but just to look at what boundaries are helpful as a yoga teacher. Alright, so these are questions I have around, like, exploring what you can do in your personal practice. So I thought I'd ask you to write down what Asana like, Is there an asana practice that's supportive for you right now? Like, are there certain poses? Is there like a certain time of day, a certain amount of time that you want to be doing an asana practice right now, maybe just make a note of that. Or even like what's not supported like other certain poses that you don't want to be doing? I've definitely found that is the case, certain poses are not helpful. I'll just give you a moment with that one.
I'll just keep going. But you can read more later. What are other movement, an exercise that is supportive for you right now, like other other practices outside of Asana, that you're enjoying, or that you would like to do more? Like, personally, I've been riding a bike that's been really awesome.
Prepare? What kinds of meditation slash are slash reflection, or inward practices? Are you finding useful? Or would you like to be doing?
And also how much and when, like, Is there a goal for you? Like, I want to be doing five minutes of meditation every day or deep relaxation, you know, a few times a week.
And then the last one I have is, are there philosophical teachings that are that you're exploring right now? And for that, I'm really talking about the yoga teachings. But are there some elements of the yoga philosophy that is meaningful, meaningful for you right now and that you're exploring in your life? Like, is there a word or concept that you're interested in? Or a whole area, like I want to study the Bhagavad Gita or I like the idea of Ahimsa, or whatever, like is there something that you're drawn, drawn by or drawn to drawn to
And then maybe, I don't know, Amber, if you want to go out, because we all think if you want to share, we don't have that much time. So I don't want to share about that, or we're just talking about boundaries. I mean, that was kind of a personal exploration, you don't have to share.
Amber Karnes 45:18
Yeah, like, think about that. And, you know, I would say maybe one thing to add is like, how you make sure that you're sustaining a self care practice? Like, do you have a way that you're, you know, kind of checking in with yourself every day or a reminder to do your practice? Like, how are you making that like a consistent part of your life. So I hope that those prompts are helpful to you. And I want to hear what you have to say about boundaries.
Jivana Heyman 45:45
Also, around that, around their own practice, I just want to say that there's some tension, I think, within the yoga teaching community around what our practice is supposed to look like. And I would just like, give yourself a break, like, it doesn't, just because you're a yoga teacher, your your personal asana practice doesn't have to be a particular way. It can be whatever, like, it doesn't really matter. But I do think some practice is useful. You know, like, if you're going to teach, it's not like, it's not just like, don't teach, if you're not practising, it's more like, find something you enjoy. And then share that with your students. You know what, I think that'll be inspiring for you. And it can be hard, like I've been teaching for, let's see, 2026 years now. And I really think like, there's some days I think, you know, what, what pose? What do I really want to do? Like, what practice do I really want? I like sometimes it's like, I've been doing so many so long. It's like, I don't want to just repeat the same thing that almost like routine, I want to kind of start fresh, like what is it that I really need today, then my practice has changed a lot. And it's like, some days, it doesn't look anything like yoga, to be honest. So you know, I might do a few poses, and then just kind of roll around. All dance, I really like to play music and dance around. To be honest, I don't tell my people that but that's my favourite practice. Anyway, boundaries, though. I just want to say that boundaries, I mean, boundaries are important in general for all of us, right? That it means a boundary is like, you know, how you set like limits for yourself and protect yourself in your life, it can be in your relationships, interpersonally, and your family and whatever. But in student teacher relationships, they're especially important. And I think in, in the spiritual teaching areas, like in yoga, it's, it's really essential received, there's so much abuse happening in the yoga world. And another kind of related communities, it's often because there's a lack of boundaries. And it's because teachers mostly haven't respected their about the students boundaries and are like, making, I don't know what they're doing. They're just feeling way too intimate with their students. And so I would just say that, as a teacher, having boundaries, helps your students. It also helps you in the end, but I wasn't gonna talk about abuse, but I want to talk about is how we tend to be givers, right? caregivers who want to take care of people. And so we give, give, give, and I think they can help us as well, to limit that in some way to be like, for example, so I want to give you good examples. If I'm teaching a class online, and then I might say, Okay, this session is from this time to this time. And then at the end of the time, students want to keep talking, I need to decide very clearly, like, how much time am I going to give for that additional, like chitchat? And it's not that you have to say none, like zero, I'm, here's the boundary, like the classes scheduled, from five to six, I'm done at six. I mean, that could be one way to go. And that that might work. Or you could just say, like, you know what, I'm willing to say five minutes more, and then tell the students like, well, we can keep talking for five minutes today. So it's not always being like hard about it, but being clear. And also maybe really reflecting on it yourself. So it's not just in the moment, you could kind of think for yourself, like, I want to give the students five or 15 minutes before after class and tell them ahead of time. This is the time we'll have to chat. Same with in person. What I found in person especially was that students would expect a lot of time after class in particular, for personal therapy and would often come to me and start sharing about very intimate things going on and wanting me to help them and it was really important to say like, I'm not a therapist. No like I that's not my position to help you with that. Do you need help finding a therapist or You know, or I could just say something like, that sounds really hard. Like, do you have support? You know, and just like, put it back on them? Like, it seems like you really need help with this situation? Are you getting that help? And it's not me like, basically, where are you finding support and like, make sure that they realise that I'm not going to be your main provider here. So that's a boundary. And actually boundaries, also just being ethical, like just having clear ethics and the way you teach and live. Which, I mean, I really, I don't know what's happened in yoga, but it just feels like it's gone out the window. Like, I feel like the and I said this earlier, but like, the abuse in yoga has been so horrific to me. I read this week, Rod Stryker, you know, him, he's a very famous teacher just talked about how he's been sleeping with his students.
It's just, it's like, it's unbelievable. So I think it comes from a lot of different places. But in the end, to me, it's about boundaries. It's about having clear guidelines about what is my relationship going to be with my students? And how much do I need from them? And how much do they need for me, and be very, very clear about that. And one more thing I'll say, then I'll stop. And that is, even if they start to see you as a source of strength and inspiration. I mean, that's okay. They can see that they can have that vision of you, as long as it's happening within the clear boundary confines of your teaching relationship. But I would be really careful about what you need from them. And just to protect yourself. I think that's where these teachers have gone wrong. I think they've gone to their students to look for something back, right? Like for me, like I've been married for 20 years. I don't need to sleep with my students like I haven't I have a partner like that hasn't been an issue for me. I mean, maybe it's because I'm also ethical, possibly, but I'll bet. But also because like I have, I have a life that I mean, like so. Try not to go to your students for what you need, right? They're not your friends. They can think of you as a friend. If they want to, that's fine. But you're not going to think of them as a friend. You're going to have your friends outside of teaching and people you go to for your support. Your job is to be a teacher. Right? You're just a teacher. And that's their role there. Yeah, I'll stop. I could go on and we're running out of time.
Amber Karnes 52:35
I know. We're almost out of time. I
Jivana Heyman 52:37
just want to add and Amanda, Heather,
Amber Karnes 52:39
go ahead, Amanda. Yeah. I mean, to
Unknown Speaker 52:44
me, that brings up is the fact that I had been saying like, but I'm befriending some people, and I might invite them in, would you suggest against that?
Jivana Heyman 52:55
I mean, it's different if you're friends with someone first. And then you bring them to yoga. I mean, that's a different situation. I'm talking about becoming a teacher, bringing in students and then starting to, like befriend them and hang out with them, and become intimate with them in some way. I think that's crossing a boundary. If they're already or friends before, I think it's okay. And I still would be careful about it. But I think that's a very different thing. Yeah.
Amber Karnes 53:25
Yeah. I think what I just want to add to what Jivana said was, don't sleep with your students there. We can just, we can say that one. Yeah, two things. One, I find that like, oftentimes, boundaries are really just about setting expectations, right? So even around things like communication, like, Are your students going to be able to text you? Are you going to give them like your personal phone number, or maybe there's one, you know, sort of place removed, maybe have an email address, or a Google forum or a Facebook group, that's maybe not your direct line, right? So think about that, like, and communicate that like when you onboard new students, or when you you know, tell your class, like, if you have any questions, here's how you can get ahold of me. And I check that email box twice a week. And you can expect to hear from me within, you know, two to three days or so, you know, let folks know, and I think that like getting really clear expectations from the beginning, no matter what you're talking about, is important. And I think the other thing, I would just echo what Jivana said about, you know, what are you looking to get from your students? I always find that kind of, you know, yes, we want validation as a teacher, right? We want to know that the stuff we're teaching is landing correctly. We want to know that people are getting something out of it, but I think there's a, you know, a big thing that can happen where it's sort of like, I don't know, teaching can be a little bit of a thankless job sometimes because people will have a really wonderful class but they won't leave like, Oh, so you don't know and then they just kind of walk you know, so Are you able to, you know, where's your validation coming from? Like, is it coming from? Do you need all that type of feedback that's like, it was such a good class, like, for me, when when somebody will say like, Oh my god, you gave me such a wonderful thing, or like, your class was so good, rather than, like, you know, I like the responsive, like, I'm glad it worked for you. Like, what I always want to do is point out to the students that like, they're the ones doing the practice, you know, there is not something magical about the way that I taught. It's the fact that they showed up and participated and had an embodied experience. And so I guess what I'm trying to say is about this validation thing is like, remind your students that, like, any magical thing that they're feeling is actually because like they did the practice, and I think that really puts, you know, I'm obsessed with this thing of like giving the power back to the students and really helping them, you know, understand the agency that they have. And I think this is just like one piece of that, that, you know, if you, I encourage teachers to, like, seek out other teachers for that sort of like validation, you know, ranting, brainstorming, like kind of stuff, rather than your students. So, you know, I don't know if that's helpful. Or maybe I'm a little scatterbrained, because
Jivana Heyman 56:25
we're out of time.
Unknown Speaker 56:29
I just want to thank you for getting out of town boundaries. Our view gun offers something similar, or is it appropriate at some point to check back in with you by email to sort of if you have questions or made progress? First off, I just did feels like I'm not totally there. So maybe half a year, I want to check back in. So I don't know, is that something you're thought about?
Jivana Heyman 56:57
You can definitely email me, I'm always happy to email people. And I put my email in the chat. And Amber, I, we haven't talked about doing this again. But I think I think we will have another session starting September 13 of the training. And so at the end of that one, we could do another of these. And I think it'd be great for any for you know, you can always join again, graduates from the past programmes are welcome to join into these groups. It's been really fun for me, actually. So I've enjoyed doing this with you.
Amber Karnes 57:27
I like this, too. I think we will do it again, I just made us a note June and talk about that. After the September training wraps, which is like towards the end of the month, so these would probably start in October. I'm guessing if we did these 10 of calls again, and we'd love to invite you all back for sure. But you can also email either of us and we'd be happy to look at you know, any questions you have or whatever. We appreciate y'all being here. This has been a lot of fun. Thank you. Thank you for all the contributions and great questions.
Jivana Heyman 58:02
Yeah, thanks. Should we thank you. Thank you. This has been helpful.
Amber Karnes 58:09
Thanks. All right. Thank you all for being part of this. Thank you. We'll see ya online.
Unknown Speaker 58:17
Transcribed by https://otter.ai